Tired of waiting/tired of dealer B.S...I'm cancelling
I'm tired of waiting, but more so, I'm tired of dealers attitudes. Over pricing orphans by more than $2300.00 worth of options (fixed pricing/non negotiable) just to boost their greedy profits, selling to anybody that walks in the door, but not concerned with people like us that have reservations. Complaining to Smart USA is useless as well, they have no control over the dealers that sell their cars(?????what?????).....oh yeah, and the orphan list that MY dealer has with all the names on it with people looking for orphans.......well, forget it....they NEVER call, but yet they have overpriced/priced gouged orphans all the time. So I wish all of you good luck with your cars and good luck with all of you who have more patience than I.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mike Knotts on -
You are going to make your dealer very happy. One more orphan to sell. You aren't related to a certain white rabbit are you? You would probably not like all the attention you would get if you owned one. Good things come to those who wait.
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Permalink Reply by GasHog on -
A robust market is a frustrating time for buyers. It doesn't matter if it's buying a house or buying something else, when a lot of people are after the same thing it makes for misery to those who are buying or waiting to buy.
Consider that this situation is identical to how toy crazes are managed, or mangled as the case may be. Ever spend weeks calling around to stores and standing in lines trying to buy some item for a child that is the latest craze? It's very frustrating duty.
I can't blame the dealers and I certainly won't. It's a free market and while as reservation holders, we have to suck up a lot of pride, the fact is that we all knew the day we put that reservation in that we had a wait ahead of us.
Also, it seems that because this car is so politically correct, there is an expectation by the reservation holders that we will be treated differently. We are in the line of reservation holders only and there are tens of thousands of us and we have no control whatsoever over it. We have an option of waiting in a second line of people who are waiting to buy orphans and that line is one which you can possibly manipulate or jump ahead to some degree. Remember that the $99 only bought us the right to order the car in a year or so. Its the way it is.
The dealers can't get 1/4 of the cars that they could sell and a reasonable person has to be empathetic to that fact. If they could get all of the cars they need, there would be tons of competition and cars would be discounted all over the place as sellers fought over buyers. But they can't get even the cars they expect...let alone what they could possibly sell if they had unlimited quantities.
Imagine how ticked you be if you were working for a SMART dealership and didn't even have a demo car to show because they were all being controlled by reservation holders and all you could do is show buyers pictures on the internet of cars?
Until supply meets demand, this will be a hard market to accept where the seller holds all the control because there are 10 or more buyers for each orphan that they get. Imagine how delighted a dealer is when someone creates an orphan? They are held to a fixed profit; have to put up with TONS of greif from frustrated buyers; provide test drives and discussion to people who can't take delivery for nearly two years; and then to top it off the market is so unhappy with them that they are trying control the ONLY thing that they (the dealers) actually can control: orphans.
While I understand your frustration, I also have been jacked up by retailers while trying to buy tickets to the Rolling Stones concert, cabbage patch dolls, beanie babies, and Pokémon cards. That whole time I never got mad at the stores who had them for a few brief seconds and then sold out or charged me more then the face value.
The American free market system is based on supply and demand, We pull up to a gas pump and pay $4/gallon but don’t blame the guy pumping the gas. We do everything we can to get into a sold out movie or rock concert. We wait for hours in restaurant vestibules, and unfortunately we have to wait for our Smart to come in or pay the going price to whoever has one; dealer, eBay, private party, etc.
And just to clarify this situation, know that I too am a reservation holder awaiting delivery. My reservation went in last September and I hope to see my car in January of '09. The one I'm driving currently was an orphan. I gladly paid for a Lojack and a few accessories that were put on by the dealer. Cut the dealers a little slack and realize that orphans are the one ray of sunshine they get in a month of agonizing complaints from "is it safe?" tire kickers and unhappy reservation holders.
I have no intention of cancelling my reservation and we will be a two smart family.
Oh and for the record, I too experienced a horribly smug attitude of the Boston dealer (Herb Chambers) so I marched right down to the next State and bought there
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Permalink Reply by Karl A Roth on -
Seems to me that canceling your reservation does nothing other than put money in the dealers pocket. Why reserve a car you don't want?
karl
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Permalink Reply by Lynn on -
My two cents for what it's worth. What does it hurt to reserve a car and then just forget about it. What have you lost. Drive your current car, look for another, bide your time. When your car comes in, buy it or sell it. I don't understand the impatient attitude everyone has. I waited 13 months and looked at other brands while I waited (I almost bought a MINI). I see the $99 as an investment. I you are in need of a car right now, buy something else.
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Permalink Reply by Jim Yedor on
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It's a car. If you want one you can pay $99 for a reservation. If you want one sooner you can buy one new from the dealer with additional stuff added or buy it on EBay without the additional stuff.
It's not a movement, your right to vote, a social contract, a birthright. It's a car, sold by individuals, for your use and their profit. The dealers aren't a charity or a non-profit. You're not entitled to a list price SMART car other than the one you have reserved. THAT particular one. All the others are not YOURS. Even you LLB.
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Permalink Reply by JIM AND JACKIE LINTON on -
I was under the impression that if a "reservation holder" after phoned had the option of purchasing or denying his Smart. If he accepted he paid the dealer the price plus any additional dealer options he added and taxes. If he refused his "reservation" then the vehicle became an orphan. At this time ownership of the car went to the dealer. This is where things start to go crazy. The dealer I purchased from originally would phone people that we on the list and ask if they were interested in an orphan car. I now believe that the dealer network has seen the demand and no longer does this. I believe that good old "supply and demand" and the way we will pay whatever it is to get what we want takes over. That makes ALL orphans become "fair meat" so to speak. I luckily have my Smart, but my sister and I both have an additional car in the reservation program. If my dealer were to phone me and I decided I no longer wanted the car, I would still take delivery and on E-bay it would go and be sold to the highest bidder. This is America and that is the American way. What I do not like is hearing of buyers that have taken delivery of 2 cars and had only become interested a month or so previously. I was told I was stupid to go through the "reservation" program. I could have just gone to the dealer and got on his list. There, the list goes to the person that is willing to purchase the most "dealer installed" options. Is this wrong, probably not? Is this ethical probably. But is this good business? That depends on whether you are a "reservation holder", an orphan buyer. So this is not the dealer that is doing this, it is the buying public. They are the ones that are creating the demand. Does anyone remember back to 1964 when the Mustang came out? I had ventured to my local Ford dealership that I had always done business with and told them I wanted the first one that came to town. I made a deposit so they would now my intentions were sure. One evening, while I am eagerly waiting, I see "my car", color, options, the whole works drive down the local "cruise" street. I run him down and ask where he purchased the car. He tells me, and it is the same dealership where MY Mustang order was placed. He then tells me, "Oh, yeah, some guy had it ordered but I paid $2,000 more than he did ". Money talks and B.S. walks. I had purchased MANY vehicles from that dealership, but when I went to have my deposit refunded, I vowed never to do business with that dealership again. That was in 1965, this is 2008 the dealership is still there, BUT they have not made a dime off me in all those years and I cannot even remember the number of vehichles I have purchased in that time frame.
Who is right? Who is wrong? We will never know the answer to that question I am afraid to say. If you want a Smart at the advertised price you wait. If you are willing to line a dealerships pockets you have the right to go that route. Me, I will wait and only hope that Smart has made some advances on some things I do not like about the one I have and be happy with the improved version.
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Permalink Reply by JIM AND JACKIE LINTON on
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Don't get me wrong....If I had not taken delivery on my Smart, I would be just as upset as others. I think the dealers should only offer the "orphaned" car to the person on the list that ordered the "EXACT" same orphaned car. That would stop a lot of the "man off the street" just walking in and purchasing a "well equipped" car. I do not have any idea of the model's orphaned, but since they have become available in the states. I would assume that because of the price there probably are a lot of Pure models and those in America are not the most popular car. Most buyers in America want everything we purchase "loaded". I wonder how long the wait would be if Penske were to "demand" that an orphaned car could only go to a person on the list with the "same" order? What are your thoughts on that one?
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Permalink Reply by Alan Perry on -
I sympathize with the original poster. I have been greatly disappointed with smart's 'new way to sell cars' (that's what they called it). While I was never going to cancel my reservation (at a minimum, I would flip the car), I did test-drive other cars that would fill the slot that the smart was intended for. BTW, the rest of the household here think that we are NOT getting the smart, so when it finally shows up it will be a surprise to them.
One thing that frustrates me is that every time that there is a posting like this, a few people will chime in that the poster "has no right to a car" and "why are you being so impatient?" These people come across to me as self-righteous with no concept of understanding and empathy.
I have been waiting 13.5 months since I reserved and my current estimates have me getting a car between 15-16 months in. This isn't like getting pissed off because the guy at the restaurant said that your order would be ready in 20 minutes and it took 25. It is a significant length of time and, considering the randomness of the DDE, it is an unbounded wait that you cannot plan around.
BTW, not all dealers are trying to take advantage of the supply/demand/orphan situation. The Seattle dealer is making their orphans available to reservation holders first, based on reservation number/date, with no markup that I know of. However, Smart does not provide the dealers with reservation information until late in the process. The Seattle dealer keeps track of the reservation holders that have contacted them.
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Permalink Reply by JIM AND JACKIE LINTON on
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I totally agree with your "I just hit the Lotto" theory. I say this because that was exactly how I felt when the dealership phoned and said my car was there. I was so excited I had to IMMEADIATELY find someone to take me to take possession. I have another thought, too. I imagine that other manufacturers will see the demand for this type of car and "clone" them. When that takes place, and it will, there will be a lot of orphans and the folks that are on long, long list will move up more rapidly and COULD even decide that they like one of the "clones". You and I both know that the auto industry in America is in a real bad situation. The lots are full of SUV's that they cannot move at any price in some cases. If you do not believe that, go to your local auto auction and see what the majority of vehicles are. People in America, finally realize that the price of fuel is NOT going to go down and while they are riding to work in their large SUV may look around and realize that there is no one in the vehicle but them. There is a lot of Missour "show me" mentality in America. When we get it we do fine, it just takes us a little longer i am afraid.
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Permalink Reply by JIM AND JACKIE LINTON on
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You are correct. All we the reservation holder "own" is a reservation TO PURCHASE. There is nothing probably in writing anywhere that says the dealer MUST sell the cars that way. They are probably going to have to set up a CLEAR policy that ALL dealers must follow. The one thing that I can see going away is the 30 Day rule. If you have not decided and arranged your financing by the time your car does arrive, you should not have the right to expect anyone to hold it for 30 days. No retail outlet will hold anything more than a day or two at the most. I have to admit I too am in the same spot. I do own my Passion coupe, but I also have a Convertible on order. That is where I am wrong. I do not have one on order. I have a reservation to order one, no more. I still have not done my configuration or anything. That is what people need to realize. UNTIL YOU CONFIGURE YOUR CAR, you have ordered nothing. They do not know what you want. They only know that they have the possibility of selling another Smart. Am I correct in this assumption or not?
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Permalink Reply by Bobby on -
Did they fail to deliver your car within the time specified when you made your reservation? If not, I dont think you have a legitimate complaint. Their obligation is to meet their contractual agreement with you, nothing more and nothing less. And GLOSONN is exactly right, unclaimed cars are the property of the dealers to do as they please. But I take it that you want price regulations on private business. This is America!
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Permalink Reply by JIM AND JACKIE LINTON on
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Reply to Bobby
I have no problem with Smart. I did not get a specified delivery time. I was told when I was notified to configure my car it would be 6-9 months. Then I received in about 6 months a notification that my car would be delivered within 90 days. Now the day, approximately 2 weeks later, the CALL we all are waiting for, like the birth of a child, "Jim, YOUR SMART CAR IS HERE". I could not get there quick enough and did not care about cost, mileage anything. I WANTED ONE, AND I HAD ONE, end of story. I would do it all over again if the same situation came up. I believe the sad part of this entire situation is that we, AMERICANS are used to getting what we want NOW....iNSTANT GRATIFICATION......well, the world does not work exactly the way WE want it to work. They say if you want something WORK for it......if you want a Smart, WAIT for it you will not be disappointed whether you decied to keep it or sell it outright. What are you out? $99. We all spend more than that taking the family out to a eat or more. I just finished taking my daughter in law and 2 grandkids to Fiesta Texas and was out $250.....would not take a million dollars for the time I spent with them. Memories, when we get old that is all we really have isn't it?
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